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  1. #1
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    Default Why discourage newcomers from moving down here?

    At one time Miami Beach didn't allow Jews to live above 5th, then Miami Beach became a Jewish city. Now its heavily Hispanic. What is gained by discouraging people from coming down here who are not Hispanic, other than to keep the status quo? I, as a Jew, wouldn't mind seeing more Jews moving here instead of to Boca or farther north. I am sure that most of us would like to have diversity here and I welcome everyone. The more people who come here who don't speak Spanish, the more accomodating people will have to be who want to speak only Spanish. Who knows what Miami Beach will be in the next generation? I encourage everyone to give it a try. Believe me, there are many worse cities to live in. We have great weather, beautiful scenery, beautiful architecture, beautiful people, and the best collection of outdoor dining in the US. Try to find a Lincoln Road elsewhere.

    :coolsmile:

  2. #2
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    I hear ya, sunaddicted; I don't see the point in discouraging non-Hispanics from moving here. If there's anything to be learned from Miami and its history is that anyone who truly wants to can make it here, regardless of language or cultural barriers.

    Also, I find that those with an attitude of "no one speaks English here" seem to hone in on the times they encounter a non-English speaker without acknowledging what it's like the rest of the time. I mean, in the middle of Hialeah or Little Havana, good luck, but everywhere else? People speak English. At least, I experience more English than Spanish, and most people switch to Spanish only if I do it first.

    I guess it's all in perspective...

  3. #3
    Editor Matt Meltzer's Avatar
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    I don't know if you all are targeting this at me, because I am just self-centered enough to believe that. But in case you were, or incase you weren't, here is why I discourage people who are not Latin from moving here:

    Over the years I have seen vastly more people from American cities move here, get disgusted with the saturation of Latin culture, and leave in a huff. Some stay, but not nearly as many as I've seen leave. Maybe it's just the transient nature of the city, who knows. I am trying to save people the aggrivation and frustration that they may likely experience when they realize that this is not moving to the Travel Channel. And again, if you live in the Beach and not the City, your perspective is skewed. And if you are Hispanic, your perspective is also skewed.

    I'm addressing anglo-Americans considering a move to Miami, and letting them know that it's likely going to be a lot harder to live here than it is wherever they are from. As someone who has lived in more than a few cities around the US, I can safely say Miami is far and away the most difficult. Especially if you don't come down here with a lot of money.

    Secondly, folks, in case you didn't notice there's a lot of traffic down here. And we keep infringing on the UDB and tearing up the Everglades as we run out of space. Why the F would we want more people here? You want to become LA?

    And speaking of LA, the 5th Street Promenade in Santa Monica makes Lincoln Road look like a Baghdhad Farmer's Market. Don't get me wrong, Miami is a 10,000,000 times better place to live than LA for reasons that I could write a book about, but the Promenade is without a doubt the best outdoor shopping/dining pedestrian mall I have ever seen.

  4. #4
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    This forum gets many requests for help in finding a place to live, or work, etc., by people who want to share the excitement and the weather here. I know its a bummer that sooner or later the euphoria wears off and the real world of work busts the always on vacation bubble. BUT! Wouldn't you rather live in an area which is so desirable that people come to on vacation? Travel from Europe, South America, all over the world to visit? Its a kick to know that at the end of the day, after work, you can relax on a Lincoln Road and watch the world walk by. Or just have a beer and watch the cruise ships glide by at Montes. Once the buzz of always being buzzed wears off, and you can appreciate the sunny daylight hours, you discover a fantastic place.

  5. #5
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    Hello. Or Hola, depending on how fast I should start brushing up on my Spanish. If I listen to some on this site, I should stay here in the Northeast because if I dont speak enough Spanish, I'll likely never get a job or obtain a comfort zone in Miami.

    It seems to be an overstatement to say that Spanish is a "necessity" in Miami. I was there a week and a half ago and chatted with people on the street and walked into coffee shops etc and everyone spoke English. I do not look like a white girl. I'm of Sicilian descent so I can pass for Italian, Spanish, Brazilian, Cuban, etc etc etc. No one even tried to speak to me in Spanish! I was surprised because when I lived in NY for 29 years, more people spoke Spanish to me than English. Same is true here in New England!

    When I look around NYC and the northeast, I do not see the majority as being white nonhispanic anymore (maybe with the except of Boston which is still, in my opinion, full of yankee puritanism). The funny thing is, I never even bothered to look around and notice different people because being around hispanics as well as other "minorities" has always been part of my life as a New Yorker. Until I started reading these blogs, I never realized how little exposure some people may have had to other cultures.

    So, Miami wont be a culture shock for me. And finding a job may take a little longer but finding the right job anywhere can always take some time. I'm a professional and I will manage. I am looking forward to all the sunshine -- and so be it if challenges exist! I studied about 7 years worth of Spanish and will likely pick it up fast once I'm immersed. My receptive language skills do suck, probably because at work, I am spoiled by translators.

    Matt: I'm wondering since you've been in Miami for 10 years or so, how long did it take you to become fluent in Spanish? I would assume that you did become fluent to manage some of the really difficult times you seem to have had based on your posts.

    Deterred to come to Miami? Not a chance. And, I have a feeling Miami will welcome me...in English or in Spanish.

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    P.S. I keep hearing about all the traffic - where exactly is it??? My husband and I drove from Ft. Lauderdale to Miami in 22 minutes during rush hour, drove all around downtown Miami in rush hour, drove to Miami Beach up and down, then went all the way back to ft. Lauderdale all the way to West palm bay. I also saw a lot less people than in the northeast. You have half the population density of a small new england state and much less than NY or Boston. Where was the traffic??? I'm not being facetious..I'm really curious. I was there in off season but still.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Matt Meltzer
    the 5th Street Promenade in Santa Monica makes Lincoln Road look like a Baghdhad Farmer's Market. Don't get me wrong, Miami is a 10,000,000 times better place to live than LA for reasons that I could write a book about, but the Promenade is without a doubt the best outdoor shopping/dining pedestrian mall I have ever seen.
    Sorry Matt but I have visited the 5th Street Promenade a few times and it is nothing, absolutely nothing compared to Lincoln Road. Its a collection of cheap chain stores and a few restaurants. The outdoor eating areas are small and confined to a few tables right outside the restaurants. Anyways, I think you have obviously had a few bitter experiences here with Hispanics and thats a shame but it doesn't make Miami Beach a bad place to live, or a hard place to live.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wants2GotoFL
    P.S. I keep hearing about all the traffic - where exactly is it??? My husband and I drove from Ft. Lauderdale to Miami in 22 minutes during rush hour, drove all around downtown Miami in rush hour, drove to Miami Beach up and down, then went all the way back to ft. Lauderdale all the way to West palm bay. I also saw a lot less people than in the northeast. You have half the population density of a small new england state and much less than NY or Boston. Where was the traffic??? I'm not being facetious..I'm really curious. I was there in off season but still.
    Its mostly on US-1 between 167 and Hallandale. Loads of strip centers and lights that last forever. I agree with you on the expressways but I-95 can get really nasty when there is an accident or construction.

  9. #9
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    ah! Nice thread really.

    Like I said in the other thread I don't think Miami would be such a culture shock to me. I am originally from France and I came to live in the US and I adapted pretty quickly, and I really can't imagine myself going back at all. I lived in tons of different cities in the south, northwest, west and honestly it was all good. But again, from what I understand finding a good job in Miami can be hard and that's the only thing that's making me hesitant; otherwise be rest assured that I would be on the plane as we speak lol.

    In any case, I think Matt's whole point, and correct me if I am wrong, is that there is a huge difference between going to Miami on vacation and actually living there. Like you said wants2gotofl you were there last week and noone spoke spanish to you, and I, too, were there last year and again earlier this month, and honestly nobody spoke spanish to me either, but I am sure that once you live there on a daily basis, things will be a little different. But just like you, I studied spanish for many years too and once immersed I am sure my spanish will be back in top shape so I am not so worried about that.

    Despite all the negative things that I have been reading, I still want to try it, because I am adventurous, and I am not scared of a challenge, and I, too, do believe that there are worst places to live in.

    Patrice

  10. #10
    Senior Member Doug's Avatar
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    It's the Third Street Promenade that's in Santa Monica. 5th Street there is just...a street! I agree with sunaddicted on that one. The Third Street Promenade is all a bunch of chain stores, like Urban Outfitters and Barnes & Noble. For food, there is no Santo or Cafe Papillon...more like Johnny Rockets and the Gaucho Grill! LA to me is one big shopping mall...but Lincoln Road has a little more sophisticated, international style to it. The people tend to be better looking, the scene, more stylish and sultry-tropical. Catch it at the right time and it feels like you're in a Jao Gilberto bossa nova. At other times, though, I must admit it can be crazy crowded and I don't know how the rushing waiters, dogs on fishline leashes and bicyclists don't all get tangled up in each other!

  11. #11
    Member Maria de los Angeles's Avatar
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    I don't think it's fair for me to comment here, because as a bilingual native, obviously Miami is in my comfort zone. The thing is, not ALL of Miami would fall into that category.

    I never discourage people from moving here, although I do think we certainly need to stop pushing that UDB.

    And I think that Matt is just being realistic when he shares his pros/cons with "gringos" who are contemplating a move here.

    In the end it just boils down to everyone's individual ability to adapt and to make the most of where they live. It doesn't matter where you live, really, if you can't be flexible and if you're not willing to (or can't) enjoy the best your city has to offer.

    Sunaddicted, I hear ya. Some parts of my life are like the Travel Channel! Seriously. I don't have a budget to do as much as I'd like, but I can at least create the mental space to really let go and just enjoy those simple things that I love about Miami. I always feel like a kid enjoying something for the very first time.

    I have known MANY locals who have the time and the means, who have lived here a loooong time, who don't enjoy more of Miami. They've been strangers in their own city.

  12. #12
    Suzanne C
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    I look white. People call me a gringa all the time. I love turning around and responding, IN SPANISH, to sh*t talkers...LOVE IT! I also love messing with people by refusing to speak Spanish...

    At a gas station:
    Me: '70 bucks on # 2 please.'
    Attendant: 'Eh? Que dijo? (Huh? What did she say?) Do jew (you) speakie espanetch?
    ME: 'Yes I do. 70 bucks on # 2 please.'

    I don't think we (me or Matt or anyone else for that matter) are discouraging people but rather educating them. Can you get around Miami without speaking Spanish- heck yeah but you can also do it without having to speak English. There are certain neighborhoods though where you may encounter difficulties.

    As for needing the language in order to get a job, the thing is that Miami is predominantly Hispanic and 99% of the businesses down here have Hispanic clients, be it local or otherwise. It's easier AND CHEAPER to hire one person than it is to hire TWO for the same job.

    Does that mean that I think people shouldn't live in Miami if they don't speak Spanish? No. I pimp Miami out to anyone and everyone that will listen, err read; but I tell the truth based on my experiences because of the site's credibility. From my experience, I know you won't die without it- look @ Gus, Michelle and Matt...it doesn't get more first hand when it comes to non-spanish speakers than those 3.

    I actually think learning other languages is cool. I'm currently working on language #4...

  13. #13
    Member Maria de los Angeles's Avatar
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    Suzy, LMAO! Same thing happens to me. I think I'm going to start the Albino Cuban Club.

  14. #14
    Senior Member Rebecca Lucente's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sunaddicted
    Its a kick to know that at the end of the day, after work, you can relax on a Lincoln Road and watch the world walk by. Or just have a beer and watch the cruise ships glide by at Montes. Once the buzz of always being buzzed wears off, and you can appreciate the sunny daylight hours, you discover a fantastic place.
    I love the mental picture you painted here addicted.

    And since I can always see both sides of every story, I have to say that everyone makes great points, and that also, if you are white and either Jewish,Loaded, Gay, or from New York/ L.I., you will have no problem finding plenty of birds of a feather here....White and from, say, Kansas and looking to rent a two bedroom on the beach for under $1000.... Now this person is going to have his rose colored knockoff gucci glasses explode before he/she even gets here... The person who is coming to "make it big" in the music industry but doest understand that Miami is the center of LATIN music, not pop music or otherwise... this person might just sing their little heart over to NY or LA and have a better shot....

  15. #15
    Senior Member Rebecca Lucente's Avatar
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    What we should really do is cast a reality show from all the various people ( very nice, interesting, funny, smart people that I am not trying to offend with this post, only to have a laugh on Miami since it's rainy and I'm bored) that come to this site thinking about moving to Miami...

    We could call it "So You Wanna Move To Miami" and all the contributing writers ( as in article writers) on the site would be the judges... We could have guest judges like Gloria Estefan, JLo, and Matt Damon.. There will be some from Telemundo as well but most of you won't know who they are so I won't bother with names....Challenges would include driving through Lemon City at night with the window rolled down [without peeing in your pants, selling flowers on the side of the road in Little Havana without the ability to speak a word of Spanish, and getting a group of rowdy white hat 21 year old boys into Suite on a Saturday night without buying a bottle.....and then the men will be subjected to a series of extra tests, such as having to pick out the one genuine girl who likes them in a sea of hot, foreign, greencard hungry women, and real or not? where contestants have to decide if boobs are real just by looking at them Oh and finally... Is she a stripper, a porn star, or just a hot chick?... For the women, there will be Which of these guys actually doesn't have a wife, and Does He Own the Lamborghini or is it a rental, and finally, pick out the guys who don't cheat, aren't gay and aren't a drug dealer/addict in a sea of hot shirtless men....

    Although there will be many prizes along the way, such as a permanent table at Suite furnished by the makers of Trojan products, and magnum upon magnum of Grey Goose...To help the winner kick-start their Miami career, the grand prize will be 2 years paid rent in a penthouse in the ICON, a 3 year lease of a turbo porsche ( duh, tiptronic) A couple hundred thousand, since 1 just ain't gonna do it, the phone numbers of a plastic surgeon who won't make you look like Tara whatsherface, a drug dealer who delivers, a realtor who won't screw you, all of the Spanish series of Rosetta Stone Learning Tools, a whole new wardrobe from Intermix..and the Easter Bunny..

    Now what channel should this be on? Well Hello I'd think this is obvious....








    ONLY ON E


    Way more entertaining than Living Lohan, I say!

  16. #16
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    I'm glad I'm not from Kansas - for more reasons than the visual of a kansas kid singing pop music in Miami.

    Of all of the pros/cons you've all written regarding whether I am worthy, as a white nonhispanic english speaker, to move to Miami, I have to say that the whole OJ thing bothers me the most.

  17. #17
    Senior Member Rebecca Lucente's Avatar
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    Tks Suzy.. I didn't realize that I might actually have to be near OJ as a writer of this site... Whoops! We don't need that!

  18. #18
    Senior Member Rebecca Lucente's Avatar
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    The winner of my fictional reality show is no more worthy of moving here than anyone else, much like the winner of top chef doesn't make the rest not worthy of being chefs... It is just the fictional winner of a fictional reality show... Besides, maybe you will win on my fictional show!

  19. #19
    Suzanne C
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    the men will be subjected to a series of extra tests, such as having to pick out the one genuine girl who likes them in a sea of hot, foreign, greencard hungry women, and real or not?
    How about just figuring out who is really a woman... :bug: We have some nice looking, um trannies. Am I allowed to say that on here Gus?

    I am also not kosher with the whole OJ guest judge thing if, as a contributing writer, I have to interact with him. I'm a blond...(for now)

    maybe Emilio & Gloria Estefan...JLo and Mark Anthony...one of the dudes from 48 hours...

  20. #20
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    Personally, I'd like to see some more gringos act as guest judges in the fictionality reality show. I'd also like them to be fictional gringos such as Dr. Christian Troy (plastic surgeon on nip tuck who formerly resided in Miami) would be #1 on my list. Some of those newer fictional gringos from that show Burn Notice on usanetworks might also qualify. Also, if I am the winner, I'd like the Rosetta stone series ASAP.

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