Miami Beach 411
Like what you see? Let's talk about how
we can help your vacation --> Contact Us
Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast
Results 21 to 40 of 51
  1. #21
    Suzanne C
    Guest

    Default

    This is going to get interesting (I'm saving the best for last)...

    Thomasl: First off, welcome to our forums!!!

    There is never a justified excuse for bouncers beating up patrons except in self defense. Your bouncer friends in my opinion were just as much criminals as those trying to leave without paying.
    That's the thing with 'fights,' it's really as simple (or complicated) as a different interpretation of 'who started it.' You'll see a drunk guy or maybe even a sober little trouble maker and they've already tried to skip out on a bill so you know they're shady to begin with but then when approached by a bouncer and asked to return to the club to the pay bill, they flip out and start cursing or worse- pushing the bouncers away. Heck, I'll use me as an example- a waitress will approach them with receipt in hand requesting the payment and then they swat your hand down and call you a name.
    I've never been in a fight in my life but I will say this, my momma taught me to hit back AND so did Darwin and I'm sure the bouncers echo my sentiment.

    Yet interpretation aside, in both these cases, a simply battery has already occurred. In this grand State, when you put one itty little finger on another person, it's battery and interpretation aside, the almighty Self Defense is no longer a question according to the law- which is why so many of these bouncers 'get away with it' or so they say...

    Dictator: also welcome...I love when my responses bring out NEWBIES- my boss Gus welcomes the added participation so :)

    SUZY, are you kidding?
    I'm not kidding. I'm Suzy- well, my birth certificate says Suzanne but that's a looooooong story which I am sure my mother AND father prefer I do not share on the internet...(that's me kidding...)

    Are you a spokesperson for Mansion (Opium Group) in disguise,
    Nah, I'm more than happy disguising myself behind my keyboard over here at MB411 besides I don't have the body fat/wardrobe required for working at Mansion. The truth is I often (I blame it on the whole "I'm a Libra" bit) will argue a point opposite of what's happened to me or someone I know just because the case is either feasible or probable. It's called 'fairness.' In this case, like it continues to be said, we don't know the whole story. There are ALWAYS 2 sides to every story with the truth falling some where in between......I wouldn't mind having the non body fat and kick-ass wardrobe of Mansion's PR rep though....

    or do you date a Neanderthal, or both?
    That's a pretty personal question there dictator...I admit that there are a few that I have nothing pleasant to comment on/about but Ive never been the 'Neanderthal' type and have always fancied the preppy, nerdy guys...but to answer your question: No, I don't date; also a really looong reason but it boils down to Nick. I don't have the time to dedicate to a relationship and am cursed by the whole parenting thing. The cursed part comes in that I am unable to play anymore as I tend to see every guy as someone's little boy. Damned Karma. I'd rather be alone than play with someone's emotions AND possibly teach my son that it's not reprehensible to take advantage of people.

    Nice try. The people with brains see right through you. Remember, this is a forum for people with some intellect, who might read, not the usual morons you are trying to fool.
    I have always maintained that these forums are based on people's opinions and own experiences- and my posts are no exceptions. I repeat: 'The truth is I often (I blame it on the whole "I'm a Libra" bit) will argue a point opposite of what's happened to me or someone I know just because the case is either feasible or probable. It's called 'fairness.''
    The people with barely-there intellect catch on so I'm guessing those with more do as well but regardless- this ain't the Bible or Wikipedia; it's a forum with welcomed, unsolicited user participation of all kinds- (new) users much like yourself commenting and/or responding to posts based on THEIR opinions. I'm suddenly reminded of Salt N Pepa's infamous lyric...Incidentally, I'm not trying to fool anyone- moron or other wise. I'm just earning my keep, running my mouth and putting food on the table for my kid...all from the confines of a keyboard...ah, the life.

    If I did verbally what the bouncers did physically, it would have been a lot worse. What a ridiculous comparison. If I offended you, which makes sense in the society we live in now, where everyone is so sensitive about every little thing, and people cry at the drop of a hat, well, I apologize.
    If more people got knocked out deservingly when they ran their mouths, there would be more violence in this country and less people hiding behind a cloak of sensitivity...

    What happens to me may not happen to another DUH but I've NEVER called out or insulted a reader/forum member (except for Wuicho because I refused to date him) on their opinion. Do I disagree- often. Do I take it personal? Hell no. I'm not offended by anything you said so please don't take it that way. I dish it 'cuz I CAN take it. Luckily the little intellect that I have allows me to respond ever so eloquently.

    Now the best....

    Sun: I had to come running when Gus told me you were sticking up for me!!!
    (insert best bouncer thug voice) "Good lookin' out dog!"

    All joking aside, I saw the video. I wish there was sound. It shows one guy babbling and a ramdom bouncer just decking him- not a mob.

    I'm trying to appeal to intellect here though: does no one else see that it makes no sense that these people were asked to pay WITHOUT a receipt or bill as they claim. There has to be something missing- something that say they forgot about after having consumed $700 worth of alcohol.

  2. #22
    New User
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Posts
    4
    Likes Received
    0

    Default

    okay, I get you now, unhappy, lonely, overweight, and trying to get a reaction out of people. At least you know what you are and are not trying to deny the truth. I like open forums and I hope we will have more positive, open discussions without the other person getting their feathers ruffled and crying like a baby, like so many in society do. Bouncers beat up people over a bill because they are animals. $700, between three guys, bottle service, the usual rip off at clubs on the beach. Who says the bill was supposed to be that high anyway and they drank a lot? and even if they did, the video shows them very meek and peaceful in their actions before the bouncers beat them up. The video shows they were not violent until they were attacked. The bouncers look like real worthless thugs. In this city though, there is very little law and there are lots of weak, emotionally fractured people who are always sensitive and understanding to criminals and violent jackasses. I am so sure the bouncers will get a slap on the wrist, but the 3 students will get a large out of court settlement.

    dictator

  3. #23
    Preferred Member jenn-NY's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    New York
    Posts
    432
    Likes Received
    1

    Default

    Suzy, I know you don't need defending, but... um DICtator? have you seen Suzy's pictures? She's definitely not fat (you should search her pics, so you can eat your words). And from what I have read about Suzy for the year or so that I've been a member of this forum, she's a great person, fun, happy, lots of family and friends, total opposite of what you have come up with by reading one or 2 of her posts. She's also pretty informative

    And secondly, what are you the lawyer for these guys??! I'm sure they have one already. In my opinion, Mansion seems wrong, but we also don't know the entire story. But there's no reason to start in on people on this forum. They didn't beat anyone up. We don't come to this forum to tear each other up. No flames allowed.

    again Suzy, I know you don't need defending (it must be my "I'm a hot blooded Scorpio, half Cuban, half Italian thing"). lol

  4. #24
    Editor Matt Meltzer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Posts
    10,738
    Likes Received
    847

    Default

    Hey Dictator, I'm as much a fan of online name calling as anyone, since I have been the recipient of such stuff for a long time. However, these forums are relly not the place for that. Comments secitons on a blog, amybe. A different typr of forum, perhaps. A chat room. But these forums are really designed to be inforamtive, not controversial or provocative. I'm never one to get easily offended, but I just think lashing out against one of our contributors for no reason is just inappropriate for this section.

  5. #25
    Suzanne C
    Guest

    Default

    I honestly don;t feel the need to defend myself but F* it, I'll play your game...

    You know what's typical in this SOCIETY dic<strike>K</strike>tator?

    People insulting others when they get put in their place and have no intellect with which to back up the nonsense that comes out of their mouth...or keyboard in your case.

    That said, I'm far from being unhappy. I could start with my son as my main source of happiness and continue on from there but the truth is that the 6000 characters I am limited to in these response boxes would not allow me anywhere near as much space as I would need to describe why my life is so much happier than that of someone who feels the need to berate strangers...and on the internet no less.

    Secondly, I am not lonely- wish that I did have time to ponder being lonely or anything else for that matter but truth be told, most days I barely have time to sh*t. I simply said I don't 'date' because I know I can't commit and don't want to use anyone for my pleasure/benefit. Where you got from that comment that I was lonely is simply a testament to your thought process or lack thereof.

    As for the overweight bit...I can't argue with you as I personally feel that I am compared to the friggin super models that walk the streets here, but FYI the AMA says I need to gain 5 lbs...but yeah, my size 5's are looking a lil snug...

    open discussions without the other person getting their feathers ruffled and crying like a baby, like so many in society do
    You mean like a smart mouthed know-it-all who becomes an instant millionaire by egging on a bouncer and then playing the crying, INNOCENT victim when he gets a few well deserved right hooks?
    Sometimes freedom of speech is overrated because some comments should warrant a fist to the jaw as a response.

    What I don't understand is why you're hell bent on this case being as simple as a bunch of bouncers just randomly beating the crap out of someone who was just trying to put money in THEIR collective pockets...Does that simplistic story really make sense to you?
    Were you there?
    Did you see it go down?
    Have you heard audio from the night? Because if you haven't, it's COMPLETELY possible that there is more to the story- which is all we are trying to argue.
    Case in point: please explain why their injuries in the video are NO WHERE NEAR as bloody (or evident) as the pictures taken by the lawyer? Before you start telling me bruises take a bit to show, I'm talking about a HUGE gash across the guy's face which is not there in the video...where'd that come from?

    Do I deny that they (bouncers/waitstaff) overstep their boundaries and hide behind their employer at times, no way. You'd have to be high, dumb or both to not see that. Could it have happened just as these guys say it did? I don't know- it remains to be seen because after all, the case is still open. That means MB police think there may be something more.

    Regardless of law or morality, we've ALL been privy to some little piss ant with big wallet/little crotch syndrome mouthing off to some one and thought 'geez, I'd love to see that guy shut him up. I bet you he'll never talk to someone like that again,' but unfortunately our suit happy society throws verbal punches and responds with litigation.

    Maybe I should file suit against you. Your tirade has left me so bewildered that I am unable to comment again in the forums thus inhibiting me from performing my job as required and allowing me to claim lost or reduced income. I think Gus may have a right to claim something too...senseless but legal...

    Like I said, if you can dish it, you should be able to take it.

    I'll also add that one bottle at a table usually starts at $400. $700 could have been 2 bottles but truth be told after gratuity and extra drinks at $20 pop that also get added to your bill, that was cheap! Well that and I've never been to a club that denied me the opportunity to sign my bar tab so they could collect on the $.

  6. #26
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    599
    Likes Received
    15

    Default

    I have this sudden urge to want to make out with Suzy now.

    :)

  7. #27
    Suzanne C
    Guest

    Default

    :kiss:

    Burgandy: has anyone ever told you that you resemble Will Ferrell? :kiss:

  8. #28
    New User
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    10
    Likes Received
    0

    Default

    Hey, I don't want to disclose too much or state my opinion at fault here as I work for the aforementioned club. But I will say incidents like this one, happen all the time - especially at Mansion. Usually they go unnoticed, unreported, or brushed over by the police.

    This case is a bit different than usual as one of the students who was assaulted has a bit of status and some right connections.

  9. #29
    Full Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    107
    Likes Received
    0

    Default

    I don't really like to get involved in personal drama, but Suzy, I think you need to step back from the role of the devil's advocate you claim to be playing and take a look at some of the comments you've made here.

    The freedom of speach is overrated? Wow. Is that what you intend to teach your son?

    And sure, we've all run into the "do you know who I am?" type. They're truly obnoxiuos. But we don't know anything about the patrons who were involved in this dispute. And the right response from those who encounter "that" type of people (if they are, in fact, "that" type of people) is to walk on by. It's not right to assault them. To do so shows a lack of intelligence and maturity.

    And the right response from those who are being paid to maintain order, for the safety of the club's patrons, is to keep their cool and diffuse the situation. And if it's not possible to do that, call the police to resolve the situation. To do otherwise shows not only a lack of intelligence and maturity, but also the lack of the right temperment to do the job you're being paid to do. It's a matter of personal responsibility and, quite frankly, the law.

    I don't really see much room here for other interpretations. I haven't seen the video but by all accounts the guys were just standing there talking when one of them got decked. If that's the case, the bouncer in question was in the wrong and The Opium Group will pay for it. Let it be a lesson to them that they need to be a little more selective in their hiring process. And let's call that a matter of professional responsibility.

  10. #30
    Suzanne C
    Guest

    Default

    That I can agree with SoBe To be- if you can't maintain your cool in a situation, then you shouldn't have a job that will tempt you constantly.

    Let's see what happens. Not that they act that much better at times, but I want to see what MBPD has to say. These guys' story really leaves me with more questions than the answers being offered. It makes no sense that Mansion would put itself on the chopping block for $700. It makes no sense that Mansion is trying to cash a 'verbal' bill. So this guy had pull but if you have the type of pull to be on a verbal tab basis with the clubs, you spend a whole lot more than $700.

    We know these guys are getting $. Period because everybody knows it's cheaper to pay and end it now than it is to drag it out....unless people start coming out of the woodworks with opposing stories.

    Again, do I know that it happens, yes and sometimes just for dumba$$ reasons like the bouncer's current girlfriend used to date some guy..stupid stuff like that. Is it legal, no way. Do I think it's right, hmmm I think that sometimes it's deserved. In my book, that makes it right. You get what you deserve.

    I have these two loud-mouthed neighbors and I always laugh at the crazy things they say. Fighting in Spanish consists of using lots of proverbs and adages like 'si no me quieres oir, no me busques.' Literally translated: if you don't want to hear me, don't look for me...Karma- trust me, it exists.

    And yes actually, I do want to teach my son that freedom of speech is overrated- some things are really more than just words. I want to teach him that it's not alright to just say anything and hide behind the legalities of an amendment. I want to teach him to speak only if it improves upon the silence. If he has nothing constructive to add, he needs not open his mouth to make himself look stupid. That's my interpretation of the old parent's adage: 'if you have nothing nice to say, then don't say anything at all,' but I admit this parenting thing is a learning process for me too...

  11. #31
    Senior Member Doug's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Los Angeles, CA
    Posts
    6,900
    Likes Received
    374

    Default

    I had a similar experience to this one in New Orleans at a bar in the French Quarter. Not to mention any names, but oh WTF, it was "Lafitte's Blacksmith Shop"! I opened a tab when I went in (giving them my card to hold), and we got about 4 drinks. When I said I wanted to close out, they didn't give me an itemized bill, either. They just gave me a credit card print-out to sign. So it is actually very easy for them to run a card without providing a bill first. At any rate, the amount on the card was about $10 higher than it should have been. When I brought it to their attention, they acknowledged the error, and brought a second print-out. I wasn't sure if the overcharge had been intentional or not, but told them I would be leaving a smaller tip.

    Although I kept my cool with them, they all got very aggressive with me and a bouncer walked over and told me I didn't have to pay anything because he was kicking me out, and he physically pushed me out of the bar. In the meantime, another customer intervened and offered to pay, putting a $20 bill on the bar -- which the bartender pocketed as the bouncer was pushing me out. A few days later, they charged my card the full amount without my signature. I disputed it, and never heard anything back from my credit card company after they sent me the initial paperwork. I also tried to contact the day manager of the bar over the next few days, but was repeatedly told they weren't around.

    The bottom line is, I don't know what happened here, but in tourist traps like New Orleans and Miami Beach, customers are routinely overcharged by aggressive staff, and intimidated if they protest, even calmly. They can run your card through, even without providing you with an itemized receipt, and they can charge it even without your signature. You can protest after the fact with your credit card company, but it's difficult to prove anything one way or the other at that point.

    For this reason, I avoid tourist traps like the plague.

  12. #32
    Suzanne C
    Guest

    Default

    But you have to have a signature- some sort of recorded proof Doug. I know this guy- (lol 'the douche') used to go to a club, open a tab and charge $50. He would sign it and then open another tab. He (and his pals) would then drink the night away. He'd leave the club that night without closing out that second tab. In the mornings, he would call the cc company and say he lost his card. He was NEVER responsible for that 2nd tab without a signature. Vendors are actually required to provide more documentation than cardholders are when disputing charges. It would be interesting to know if Mansion did charge a credit card...

    Completely unrelated, just to prove he was a douche, he would ask his friends for the cash equivalent of their consumption later...

    But you make a great point Doug. What if these guys were asking for an itemized bill vs a no bill scenario? Am I naive in thinking Mansion can't refuse...right? (I've never been instructed to do anything illegal at any place of employment...cya lol)+ why is there no video from before the back office and why is there no sound from the office video????????? That grainy b/w video is a tease...I was so disappointed with it.

    And you're right, Mansion has seen more tourists lately...we need a new 'it' club.

  13. #33
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    599
    Likes Received
    15

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Suzy
    :kiss:

    Burgandy: has anyone ever told you that you resemble Will Ferrell? :kiss:
    Thanks, Suzy. But I look more like a blend between Brad Pitt, George Clooney, and David Beckham.

    I think Mansion stopped being the "it" club about 2 years ago. I don't know anyone who goes there anymore. Just tourist and a few people from Hialeah.

  14. #34
    Senior Member Doug's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Los Angeles, CA
    Posts
    6,900
    Likes Received
    374

    Default

    But you make a great point Doug. What if these guys were asking for an itemized bill vs a no bill scenario?
    It's my understanding from the previous posts (I haven't seen the video yet!) that they wanted an itemized bill, before they would agree to sign the credit card print-out. And there is the distinct possibility that all that roughing up in the back room was intended to make them sign the credit card print-out, though they are able to charge the card, regardless.

    Why someone would spend $200, let alone $700, for the privilege of having a table with some booze on it is a mystery to me, but just call me weird!

    I do know from delivering pizza, though, that people can have their cards charged without ever signing the receipt. When I contested the Blacksmith Shop episode with my credit card issuer, I had to provide an explanation of what happened and state why I felt I was not obligated to pay this charge, even though I hadn't signed the credit card print-out. So, it seems like there is more to it than just not signing the print-out and not being responsible for the bill. Of course, my bill was only about $30, not $700, but there is the matter of principle. Especially if you're cheap :) For $700, I'd expect to be able to spend the whole night there, and even set up a tent if I wanted...

  15. #35
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    599
    Likes Received
    15

    Default

    Here is a very interesting read on what happens in Vegas...

    http://www.lasvegassun.com/news/2008...couple-bundle/

  16. #36
    Suzanne C
    Guest

    Default

    [quote=Doug]
    ...Why someone would spend $200, let alone $700, for the privilege of having a table with some booze on it is a mystery to me, but just call me weird!...

    You're not the one I would call a name in that scenario... I admit that it's comfortable to sit when you're tired but I usually figure it's 'wanna-be baller' syndrome. Face it- VIP sections are for the ballers (AKA A listers), the wanna-be ballers(old $, new $, mommy/daddy's $) or a group of 4 guys with a high tolerance and combined monies. If you ask me, for $700 I want a foot massage, someone to clean my feet every time a drink is spilled on me and a personal mini-taser to use on every guy who thinks grabby hands is cool with a stranger if you follow it up with a wink and a smile...it's not fair that I can't hit these guys...

    I'm trying to remember any bill I've ever signed- were they itemized???? Man I wish I was a packrat. Truth be told, there's so much alcohol in me at that point that even the numbers are dancing on the receipts...

    We certainly have to offer up lots of information when people dispute charges and the burden of proof is usually on the vendor.

  17. #37
    Senior Member Doug's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Los Angeles, CA
    Posts
    6,900
    Likes Received
    374

    Default

    Burgandy, no wonder they have that expression, "What happens in Vegas, stays in Vegas." If it got out what they were doing, nobody would ever want to visit that glittering sandbox.

  18. #38
    New User
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Posts
    4
    Likes Received
    0

    Default

    well, the supreme court has ruled there are limits on free speech (can't yell fire in a crowded theater, etc.) however, I am not their lawyer. We need lawyers because if we didn't have them, there would be little effort or change by people and corporations who are negligent. most people act the most when their pocket books are on the line, as depressing as that may seem. mansion/Opium Group will lose and the students will win. Thank you Doug, So Be and the rest of the people who realize that Suzy was just a little too hasty when she jumped to the defense of Mansion, with her examples of people who walked out, her comment about little crotches, as if anyone who complains or mouths off has a small whatever, which shows what i said all along, and I do NOT want to call names to offend, but isn't that what you are doing Suzy, berating a man and the alleged small size of his penis if he has a loud mouth? why can you call names and insult people, but if I do it, I am wrong? Free speech... nothing to say, then don't say it... Hmm...how about a word association that applies to you, it starts with Hyp and ends with e. Have any guesses? And you say you could sue me? Your example if pathetic. I would be what you are if I didn't admit I was wrong in some ways, but I still can't help notice your quick attempt to defend Mansion, insult and berate and the guys who got beat up, overly question the color videos of the incident, question if I am their lawyer (which is behaving in the same way I did when you said my reactions and name calling were wrong), and then quickly tone down a bit when some other people noticed your one sided slant and your quick backtracking-to an extent. You still question even now, whether the wounds were real as per the photos. The police probably doctored them, right? I stand by what I said before. the bouncers are animals, and they beat the guys up for no reason. The students were correct in asking for a bill. the video clearly shows the guys pleading with the bouncers, and the bouncers knocking them to the ground, etc. Why did all the bouncers take those guys into the back room? why not just have a few go in, ask them to pay the bill, present an itemized bill, and if they didn't pay, call the police? ever heard of the last man standing law? probably not. these students know that the ONLY WAY to get justice in this country when you have been hurt, is through a civil suit. The law in Florida is a joke when assaulting anyone. you can kill almost anyone, smash their face in, etc., and most of the time, do very little time. Even elsewhere. Look at OJ Simpson. He killed his wife, slit her throat, and walked. When did the family get justice? When they sued him and won. The garbage in Watts that acquitted OJ weren't able to get on the civil jury because the civil attorneys knew how to keep them away, unlike the idiot prosecutors in the criminal trial who actually thought they could get a conviction.
    No, you are wrong Suzy. You even made reference to your weight, I just commented on what you said. No, I did not look at your pictures, but who cares anyway. I am glad you have a son. Better to teach him to speak up when something is wrong and try to make a change rather than sit back and don't say anything unless you have something nice to say. That is ridiculous. Forget Vietnam, forget the Berlin Wall, forget equal rights, etc. Just everyone keep your mouth shut unless you have something pleasant to say. And if someone like Suzy has an opinion that angers other people, too bad, just keep your mouth shut. After all, Suzy was a waitress and obviously has plenty of past anger against certain types, and even cites examples of men with small crotches, loud mouths, people that don't pay, etc. Have you seen the size of their crotches? What if they are large? Will that make it okay that they asked for a bill and spoke up? If you think a guy needs a big crotch in order to speak up, or if your are saying that every loud mouth is small, are you really being intelligent? Or is that some way to insult people, or do you think that comparison or "observation" is cute or clever? You say something I don't like, I am going to speak up. Once again, if I called you a name you didn't like, I apologize, but I stand by what I say and I am not backtracking and I am not a hypocrite.
    I am tired of people whining and crying for every little thing-NOT YOU, just a point that came up. Our society has become emotionally fractured and there are lots of cry babies out there and it needs to stop. If you have a legitimate complaint, great, do something about it. Example of the weak lunatics of society: go back and watch the Ellen Degeneres show when she opened her program crying like a 3 year old because someone took her rented dog away. It is time for a change!
    Dictator

  19. #39
    Jim
    Jim is offline
    Member Jim's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    Surfside
    Posts
    322
    Likes Received
    3

    Default

    Like we said in Nam...."kill em all; let god sort em out"

    Just kidding. My money says the guys were jerks, and the bouncers went too far.

    Remember John Lennon..."All you need is Love"

  20. #40
    Senior Member Doug's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Los Angeles, CA
    Posts
    6,900
    Likes Received
    374

    Default

    I must say, Dictator, that you've shown us that rage is not an effective way to resolve a disagreement!

Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •